Not convinced by depth of BC outrage

Not convinced by depth of BC outrage

I love the fact that when Boston College—“A college in the Jesuit tradition!”—honors pro-abortion Democrats, not a peep is heard except from the faithful remnant pro-lifers and orthodox Catholics on campus. But when the pro-abortion honoree is a Republican, suddenly all the “Catholics” come out of the woodwork demanding the college live according to the Church’s teachings.

This is what happened when BC invited Secretary of State Condoleeza Rice to be commencement speaker. Now, let’s be clear: because she is a pro-abortion politician, I agree that Rice should not be given a platform at which to speak at BC nor should she receive honors, as agreed upon by the US bishops a couple of years ago in the document “Catholics in Political Life.”

That said, I find it somewhat hypocritical that suddenly certain people at BC are up in arms. In fact, it sounds like they object more to the War in Iraq than to Rice’s views on abortion.

‘‘On the levels of both moral principle and practical moral judgment, Secretary Rice’s approach to international affairs is in fundamental conflict with Boston College’s commitment to the values of the Catholic and Jesuit traditions and is inconsistent with the humanistic values that inspire the university’s work,” the letter said. It pointed out Pope John Paul II’s opposition to the war in Iraq.

Could anyone actually point me to a quote from Pope John Paul where he specifically condemned the war in Iraq? I want to see it in black and white, not simply a general deploring of the evils of war.

In any case, I’ll be more sympathetic to the cause when I hear the same people protesting next time, say Larry Flynt, comes to campus, or some other pro-abortion, pro-filth partison of the Democrat persuasion. I’m not convinced this doesn’t have more to do with liberal politics than it does Church teaching.

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  • What a revelation that Fr. David Hollenbach,S.J., is using words of Pope John Paul II to defend his position on this issue! Fr. Hollenbach’s words about Pope John Paul II’s Theology of the Body at the George Weigel Lecture were that Pope John Paul II’s teachings on moral issues and sexuality were “false” !  He stood up and stated this loudly at the end of George Weigel’s talk on the works of Pope John Paul II at a B.C.Edu presentation a few years ago. After the presentation I had the opportunity to speak to Fr. Hollenbach. I asked him if he had ever really read The Theology of the Body. He said that he read it and that it was not the truth.
    I wonder what he teaches his students about the relationship of man and woman in marriage, the meaning of chaste living, virginity and celibacy for the sake of the Kingdom and our hope in the eternal relationship of the Trinity, all of which Pope John Paul II explored in The Theology of the Body. Perhaps Fr. Hollenbach has written his own book on the subject! He certainly rejects Pope John Paul’s words on these very vital issues.
    I haven’t heard that Fr. Hollenbach is supporting the teachings of the Church on marriage in any public way as the issue is going before the Mass. State Legislature on May 10. What say you,Father!

  • Mario: You’re obviously new here. My track record of examining Boston College’s selective approach to the Church’s teaching is well established. You really haven’t addressed the selectiveness of this outrage. Where is the outrage over the activities and events and speakers that undermine the Catholic faith? Just look at Alice’s comment for one example.

    My Catholic faith would be absolutely empty if it rested solely upon my belief in the dignity of the unborn.

    There are some Catholic teachings which are non-negotiable and the sanctity of life is one of them.

    GED: I said the Pope saw war as deplorable, but sometimes you have to do things you’d rather not do because they’re necessary. The Church has a tradition regarding Just War. Certainly, the Church’s constant teaching has held that abortion is always evil and can never be condoned as legal, whereas the same across-the-line condemnation cannot be applied to either war or the death penalty.

    Scott: Sorry, but I didn’t see in that what I was asking for? Regardless, that was a parenthetical remark and tangential to my point above.

  • Ferde: I’m not a Republican. I’m politically conservative. That may be a subtle difference to some people, but it’s a very clear one.

    Don’t put words in my mouth. You can’t read my mind and don’t know my thoughts on the Church’s social teachings vis a vis the Republican Party.

  • I don’t get the Pax Christi Catholics.  I came from 6 generations of servicemen in my family and war is the last resort, but they did their duty to bring peace into the world, whether it was fighting the Spanish Empire’s occupation of the Philipines, the Nazis in Europe, or the Communists in Vietnam.

    The real peacemakers of our country are the men and women in uniform who volunteered to defend the principles of freedom.

    Regardless, Rice should not be allowed to speak at BC because she is pro-abortion and not because she is Secretary of State during this time of war when we should all the be supporting the effort against terrorism.

  • Did Fr. Kenneth Himes,OFM Cap.,Chair of the Boston College Theology Dept., make any public
    statement to protest the organization launched by an openly gay Theology professor, John McDargh, called the Lesbian and Gay Faculty,Staff and Administrators Association(LGFSAA) which serves as a resource and advocacy group as noted in the Bay Windows issue(6?3/04),“BC faculty band together to promote change” by Laura Kiritsy? The LGFSAA is working with LGBC and the “Alliance”(Gay,Straight Alliance) to make changes in policies at B.C. to attract more faculty who practice and promote their agenda . The fact that Fr. William Leahy,S.J. promised the Theology faculty that “the decision to seek a mandate or not is a private decision for each theologian. It won’t effect hiring or promotion at Boston College.”..further,Fr.Leahy stated:“My position is to hire people who can contribute to our educational mission and heritage-no matter what their faith.”(Boston College Magazine-winter 2000,p.p.8,9). One can only imagine how the openly same-sex sex practioner and promoter,Theology professor John McDargh, contributes to the Jesuit mission of Boston College as he teaches students in such courses as “Spirituality and Sexuality”! Fr. Himes has not spoken up to defend the “Jesuit mission”. You don’t suppose he is afraid to do that, do you?

  • As one of the only people on this forum who currently studies at BC, I can tell you that this place is far from orthodox.  There is an orthodox minority here, but we are not the majority.  I can also tell you that I do not know of a single orthodox Catholic in the theology department.  Furthermore, the students who are signing this petition are, for the most part, pro-abortion.  One, whose name I will not use, was even quoted as saying something along the lines of, “We are told we can’t have a pro-abortion club on campus, but they’ll let a person who supported the war in Iraq come to speak.  The hypocrisy!”

    The American bishops were very clear two years ago.  She cannot be honored here due to her pro-choice ways.

  • Dom:

    I think you should set up a new category called Jesuits, so everyone can see you previous posts on this subject and understand you views better.

    We who have been around for a while, understand where you stand.



  • Am I to understand that Dom has a view on Jesuits?

    If so can someone please summarize?

    Yes, someone please summarize for me too. That would be most instructive.

  • “The war in Iraq is simply a recognition that the days of “containing” terrorism and treating it as a law enforcement matter are over.”

    Unfortunately, Sean H, that’s only until another Democrat is elected president.  Don’t forget, Kerry looked forward to the day when terrorism went back to being a nuisance…

  • Does Dom have an opinion on the Jesuits… I AM NOT SURE!!!

    would these help?

    Dec 18 by Dom:  The Jesuits: Spitting in Mary’s eye againWhoever’s in charge of the Jesuits today, it’s certainly not St. Ignatius. Nor anyone in his mold

    Jan 26 by Dom:  Those Jesuit problems
    People who don’t like others questioning whether there is a systemic problem with the Society of Jesus need to explain why every single Jesuit-run college is a hotbed of heterodoxy and dissent.

    … just to name a few…

  • What do you know I do have an opinion. Well, I have an opinion of how the Society is being run today, but I suppose that could be seen as splitting hairs.

    However, seeing as how I count some Jesuits as very good acquaintances who I respect and admire, I won’t say that those quotes express everything I think about Jesuits.

  • Fr. Powell,

    “It is mistaken to think that this fine institution of higher learning, which you seem to be deriding, is scarce of people who recognize what the Church teaches.”

    You mean like Fr. James Keenan, who testified in favor of same-sex marriage in Massachusetts???  And this guy is teaching moral theology???  What the heck is going on at that “fine institution” of higher learning?

  • It is a culture that seems to think that war solves problems, that is okay with cutting social services, that condones capital punishment

    Wars can solve problems: Hitler (Germany 1940s), Tojo (Japan 1940s), Milosevic (Bosnia 1990s), Al Queda (Afghanistan 2001).  It also seemed to fix slavery in the US (1860s), establish freedom for the US (1776).  The war in Korea in the 1950s did a neat job of repulsing an incursion by Commies, I’m sure the residents of South Korea appreciate it today, too bad we didn’t wipe the Reds completely off the peninsula.

    That being said, I think Iraq is a big mistake. I’m a retired warrior, my old units have been there. My solution if any nation truly threatens us … just nuke it (it worked wonderfully on Japan, they even make cars and play baseball nowadays). Iraq never threatened us, it is not worth even one Marine suffering a hang-nail, it’ll never have democracy and our warriers are not social workers.

    Capital punishment has always been allowed for in Roman Catholicism. See St. Tomas de Aquino and all Popes before Pope John Paul II.  Opposition to capital punishment has always been fashionable among the communists … they prefer the gulag.

    Social service spending by the government is a function of socialism and must always be opposed by Roman Catholics (to include opposition to public education.)  Catholics should work through their parish St Vincent de Paul societies to take care of their poor neighbors … relying on apostate politicians is not advisable (the rabble representing Massachusetts is a clear example of how this goes all wrong.)

  • Just a reminder to everyone: Do not post the full text of other people’s copyrighted materials. If you want to reference a news story, put a link to the original.

  • Ferde, Ted Kennedy was a kid when he drove off the bridge?!  He was in the US Senate!  His brother had been dead almost 6 years.


  • Ferde,

    It was not a criminal homicide – he was drunk?  You have to be kidding?  If a drunk driver killed someone in your family you wouldn’t call that a crime? I didn’t say it was murder, I said it was criminal.

  • Last weeek when asked about the Jesuit vow of obediance, Fr. Keenan said it only applied to where the Jesuits are assigned.  “If he wants me to go to India, I go.”  He also thinks all being a Catholic university means is to ask the “Catholic questions,” which is only one question, but on various topics, “How do we move the Catholic intellectual tradition forward?”  At least he doesn’t persecute his orthodox students.

  • I find it hard to believe, with all the information on the record, that any sane, intelligent person would continue to defend this incompetent, inept and corrupt administration.  It boggles the mind.

    Gee, Ferde, as long as you bring B.C. up… wink

    Anyway, couple of points.

    Your insinutation that somehow Miss “Kopneckni” (the lady — and her family — is named “Kopechne,” Ferde…and yes, in this case, spelling does count) was somehow responsible for her own death is beyond the pale.

    I don’t know if she was [drunk] and won’t speculate, but she may have at least been under the influence.

    Uh…that would be called “speculating.” Please don’t say you “won’t” and then go ahead and do it anyway. By speculating after you promised you would not speculate, what does that make you?

    Anyway, why this thread has turned into a defense of the Senior Senator is beyond me.

    Your conclusion about Bush’s being justified in going to war is completely false by any standard.  The man is a liar.

    I disagree.

    I supported, and continue to support, the President’s effort in the war on terror. I do not believe he is a liar.

    I also admire Condoleeza Rice very much, and think she’s done an admirable job.

    And I think Ms. Rice (to get back to the point) is honoring Boston College by even thinking about showing up to its commencement exercises.

    Now. To keep this thread on topic (if anybody cares about that anymore) I have a couple of questions:

    1.) Do commencement speakers and/or honorary degree recipients get paid for their participation (other than the degree, I mean)?

    2.) Is it somehow a longstanding plumb in one’s career to receive an honorary degree from an institution like Boston College…or any college, for that matter? Or is it a momentary publicity thing?

    I’m asking because I really don’t know.


  • Having a reading comprehension problem?

    Actually, no, Ferde.

    I said I wouldn’t speculate on her being drunk and I didn’t.

    You wrote that you wouldn’t speculate on Miss Kopechne’s being drunk. Then, in the same sentence, you proposed — make that speculated — that “she may have at least been under the influence.”

    If you want to utilize a semantic technicality to defend your statement (“drunk” vs. “under the influence”), that’s your choice.

    But don’t question my ability to read while doing it.

  • Ferde,

    OK, I’ll accuse Ted Kennedy of murder, or at least complicite in facilitating the murder of over 47 million unborn children since Roe v. Wade through his voting record and rhetoric.  Regarding Kopechne, at the very least, Kennedy is guilty of poor judgement.